Welcome back to The COO Solution Podcast! In this episode, host Derek Fredrickson sits down with Kristie Clayton, founder of Herverse and a seasoned second-in-command leader turned visionary, to explore what it really means to thrive in leadership.
Kristie shares her journey from COO to CEO, the power of Integrator–Visionary partnerships, and why embracing “whole human leadership” transforms not only how we lead, but also how we live. From the sandbox analogy for vision and execution to building trusted communities for women executives, Kristie’s insights are packed with wisdom and practical takeaways.
If you’ve ever wondered how to balance strategy with emotional intelligence—or how to step fully into your role as a leader without losing yourself—this conversation is a must-listen.
In This Episode:
[01:32] Kristie’s journey from second-in-command to visionary leader.
[06:21] The “energy boost vs. vampire” test: how to find your leadership sweet spot.
[10:42] Why visionary–integrator partnerships are essential for scaling.
[16:07] How to say “no” without stifling your visionary’s ideas.
[20:59] The sandbox analogy: creating space for ideas before execution.
[23:35] Whole Human Leadership—bringing strategy + emotional intelligence together.
[28:38] A real-world story of leading with empathy instead of just data.
[33:55] The origin of Herverse: building community for women second-in-command leaders.
[41:30] What to expect from Herverse membership, mastermind, and annual summit.
[45:22] Kristie’s gift: a special discount for listeners to join Herverse events.
📌 Why This Matters
True leadership isn’t about titles or doing it all—it’s about alignment, energy, and leading as your whole self. By embracing the integrator–visionary dynamic and connecting with supportive communities, you can grow faster, lead with confidence, and create lasting impact.
✅ Action Steps for Listeners:
- Identify whether your current role is giving you energy or draining it.
If you’re a visionary, give your ideas a “sandbox” before execution. - As an integrator/COO, practice saying “tell me more” instead of “no.”
- Explore communities like Herverse to surround yourself with peers on the same journey.
Resources & Links:
Transcript:
00:01
Derek Fredrickson
Hey, everybody, it’s Derek Fredrickson here. And welcome back to The COO Solution Podcast. We have a fantastic episode with a fantastic guest. We have Kristie Clayton with us today. Hello, Kristie. Welcome to the show.
00:14
Kristie Clayton
Hey, Derek, thank you for having me. I’m excited to be here.
00:17
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah, I think today is going to be a good episode. And I started by saying we’ve got our color sync on. We’re going to talk about things like visionary and COO sync and team sync and everything else, but we are aligned in our color. It’s very rare when I don’t wear blue. So I’ve got the pink on, which is matching your pink. You’ve got your pink glasses on.
Kristie Clayton
I love it.
Derek Fredrickson
But, yeah, we’re going to talk about a lot of things today, actually, I met Kristie through one of our fractional COOs here at The COO solution, and we had a great conversation. We have a lot in common in terms of our thoughts and beliefs on things, all things
00:53
Derek Fredrickson
with second in command. We’re going to talk about COOs and integrators, and not just the work that we do and the work that you’ve done in the past, but also we’re going to talk about community, specifically community for women leaders. And I know that you’ve got a fantastic organization, Herverse, which we’ll talk about as well today.
So, so let’s just dive in. I’d love to understand a bit more for our audience in the beginning.
So you started out, Kristie, as an integrator, as a second in command, and you kind of. I don’t want to say transition, but you shifted now into more of like, a visionary, the CEO of herverse. Why don’t we start there and talk a little bit about what that transition was like and then we can continue on into the conversation.
01:32
Kristie Clayton
Absolutely. Yeah. I started my career. If you look back at my career, it’s clear that I’ve almost always sat in that, in that second in command, you know, whether it’s COO or I was in medical, we called it a practice manager, the integrator. And listen, there’s a plethora of titles that we use.
01:52
Derek Fredrickson
We have them all.
01:53
Kristie Clayton
Oh, we do. And I’m hearing some really interesting ones. You know, chief of staff has been showing up a lot lately. President is still being used, vice president, chief operating officer, but even things like operator and orchestrator and some uniqueness. But if you look back, it’s clear that’s the role that I had always been in. And then when I found EOS and really started honing in on my skills, I had a lot of people coming to me and saying, you do realize you’re much more visionary than you give yourself credit for, right? No, I’ve honed my skills and I’ve worked really hard to be a really great second in command leader. And so I really pushed back on that for a while.
02:37
Kristie Clayton
And I think, Derek, if I’m being honest, one of the other reasons that I really hesitated being labeled as a visionary leader is because there was also some negative traits that really get shared a lot about this role. Right. We’re chaotic and disruptive and you know, we’ve got 20 ideas a day, but you know, we can’t stay focused. And I was like, “but ooh, that doesn’t describe me, right?” Because I’m very much so a visionary leader who is, I really sit down and I think about what it is, uhm what idea is coming to my mind? Why is that coming to my mind? What is the outcome that I’m looking for? And you know, why has this surfaced for me? Am I solving the solution?
03:18
Kristie Clayton
And so I have a lot of internal conversations with myself before I even bring it to now my second in command that I have. And so I really pushed back on that for a long time. I cannot be this visionary leader because I am the opposite of some of the traits that are often portrayed. Uhm But then I really, truly… I give credit to Alec Broadfoot from Vision Spark all the time because he came to me and he was like, you do realize you’re a visionary. You do know that, right? Uhm, And then when I, when I formed uhm what originated as Female Integrator Mastermind or FIM, that’s where I really started leaning into my visionary of… “I do have these ideas. I do have my own thoughts and opinions and ways that I would like to have this organization run.”
04:10
Kristie Clayton
And that’s when I started to shift to, you know what? There are different types of visionaries and it is okay for me to be the disciplined, the well put out, the structured visionary. And then there are others that are out there like me too. And so I really had to shift away from the dialogue in the persona that has kind of been portrayed for this person to discover who I was as a visionary leader.
04:37
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah, I can appreciate that. And this is why I think we’re very alike because I, I relate 110% to what you’re sharing because as we talked about, I’ve been doing second in command. You know integrator, COO work for 17 years. And with the COO solution, I’ve had to take the COO hat off and be the CEO. And I know that I’m not wired like most other CEOs. I don’t have the same strengths. And that’s not a negative to the extent I try to use it as a positive. So same to you. I’m disciplined, I’m structured, I’m reflective. When ideas come to me and they come to everybody, I contemplate, I weigh the pros and cons. I kind of see all the way through to make a decision as opposed to, in some cases.
05:20
Derek Fredrickson
and this is what’s brilliant about working with visionaries. They do have a thousand ideas and they like to kind of, you know, throw spaghetti at the wall and then see what sticks. And I like to see the spaghetti and think about it and kind of understand what’s really going to be the implication of that. And I think also what you shared earlier, when you were discovering this possible transition as you were an integrator, you were saying something about, like, working hard and almost feeling like, but that’s who I am. And when we feel like whether you’re an integrator who’s thinking about owning your own business or you’re a visionary, but you sometimes operate as an integrator, it’s fine. When it feels like work or hard work, that’s the sign that things are out of alignment.
06:01
Derek Fredrickson
And so being able to open to that shift and also with your community and Herverse and everything that you’ve created, I think especially for a visionary to say, like, okay, that’s my big picture. That’s my why. That’s the thing that’s pulling me forward. That’s where all the excitement and all the ideas come together. So I can really appreciate your story there and your transition on how that took place.
06:21
Kristie Clayton
Well, and I, I think there was a big, like, light bulb moment for me too, Derek was when we had a Tony Bednar from what is now Strategic Talent Partners come in and talk to one of our mastermind groups. And he was going through the integrator continuum and the different types of integrators that there are. And what I started to realize is, oh, this is the big aha moment for me, that there are different types of integrators, therefore there are different types of visionaries. That was my first aha. But then when I was looking at the integrator continuum, one of the things on the right hand side of the continuum is more of that strategic partnership, that kind of advisor to the visionary. And I realized, well, that’s the world I love to sit in. I love doing that strategy.
07:13
Kristie Clayton
I love kind of thinking through all of that. Now, can I do the other side of the continuum, which is more of that people process, metric management? You know, am I okay being in the middle where, you know, it’s much more aligning the business with a product or service. Can I do all those things? Yes. But here’s what I learned, is that it’s either an energy vampire for me or it’s an energy boost. And if you put me in the right side of the continuum or even kind of in the middle, it is a vampire for me. It sucks my energy. I will look down at the clock and go, oh, my goodness, it’s only one o’clock. I can.
07:56
Kristie Clayton
It was 7pm I go out into, you know, my living room and I sit on the couch and I have no energy to do anything else. I don’t even. I remember saying to my husband several times, please don’t even make me, like, decide what we’re eating for dinner. Because I have no mental capacity to make another decision. Like, I cannot do it right. I made this decision all day long. I do not have the capacity to do another one. However, I’m in that strategic integrator. And now that I’ve moved into that visionary role, that’s an energy boost for me. I mean, you might as well shoot 10 cans of Red Bull straight into my blood banks. Because I am just so excited. I look down and I’m like, oh, it’s five o’clock. I have to stop working.
08:42
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
08:42
Kristie Clayton
I’m energized and I’m excited. And instead of going and being a couch potato, I’m like, hey, let’s get up and let’s go for a walk and oh, let’s go, you know, do things together. Because I still have so much energy remaining in me.
08:57
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
08:58
Kristie Clayton
And that’s the big thing for me was realizing first that there’s different types of integrators, which means there’s different types of visionaries. And it was okay for me to be the type of visionary I was. I did not have to conform to what everyone trade as a visionary.
09:14
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah. It’s such a great point, really, for anyone who’s listening, whether you’re a visionary, you’re an integrator, you’re a marketing manager, you’re a fractional CFO. It’s becoming really clear on who you are, what lights you up, what adds value to, not only the client or the work that you’re doing, but also adds value to you. Right. I love the analogy. Like at the end of the day, would you want to jump up and you can’t wait to get out of bed and do it all over again? Or at the end of the day, you’re drained and saying, I’m not really looking forward to doing that all over again tomorrow. And being able to compartmentalize, especially as a visionary integrator. There are some elements as an integrator bring into the sweet spot.
09:55
Derek Fredrickson
There are some elements as the visionary bring into the sweet spot. You don’t have to use the label, it’s just that I could do this, but it doesn’t mean that I should do that.
10:04
Derek Fredrickson
And I like being able to influence the part of the strategic component because I think, especially for those second in command integrators that work with visionaries, being able to be that trusted second in command, that thought partner, that strategic sounding board, is critical because at that level of a company, when you’re all alone as a visionary, you need somebody that you can lean on, not just to get stuff done and take care of business, like you said, the people, the metrics and everything else, but also be able to have that strategic dialogue to feel like you’re on the right path, we’re on the right train of what we need to do and it really needs to be in alignment in that regard. So I can, appreciate giving.
10:42
Derek Fredrickson
Whether you’re a visionary, an integrator, be the visionary that you want to be, that you can be and same as an integrator. So I’d love to talk a little bit about, you know, in the work that we do, the dynamic of the visionary integrator. We’ll just call integrator, visionary integrator partnerships. in your experience and in your view, why is that partnership, that duo so vital? Why is that the thing that really can take things to another level when you’ve got the connection between the visionary and integrated? I know you’ve experienced this, you have people in your community that offer and do this with their clients. But in your experience and in your mind, why is that such an essential element for a scaling company that’s looking to get to the next level?
11:30
Kristie Clayton
Yeah, that’s such a great question and I think it has layers of answers for me. First, is there really Truly is. There’s a lot of people that can do both. Like I have no doubt there’s some really talented people that can do both. And so it’s not a matter of whether you can. It’s really, truly goes back to where are you finding your energy? Where do you find your excitement? Because what I have found is that the visionary role, and again, insert plethora of titles because we love to use a whole bunch of them there too. But visionary role, our mindset is usually just a little bit different. We are constantly forward thinking, future thinking. Right?
12:10
Kristie Clayton
And so what I have learned, transitioning from integrator to visionary and truly owning visionary because I have a second in command now, what I have learned is that my brain naturally loves to think about what we will be doing in the future. As integrator or that coo. We’re often, we think about the right now and the short future. Right, the short term. So if I, as visionary am constantly thinking three years out and I’m able to bring those thoughts and ideas to my integrator to say, hey, here’s some things that I’m thinking about. They’re like, this is fantastic. When are we doing this? Where’s it fitting in? You know, how does all of this, how does this fit the big picture and then turn it into the short term, whether that means 1 year, 90 days, whatever.
13:06
Kristie Clayton
But it keeps me thinking future, which I love. Right? Actually, I don’t really enjoy. Again, can I think about short term? 100%. But again, vampire versus boost, where am I going to sit? Might get my energy. I get my boost from thinking about forward thinking.
13:27
Derek Fredrickson
Sorry, but keep going.
13:28
Kristie Clayton
That’s okay. No, go ahead, chime in.
13:31
Derek Fredrickson
I want to share this because it’s the same reflection. I remember when we worked with an EOS implementer for a long time and we were taking assessments and understanding like how we’re wired and to take action and strengths and everything else. I remember. And in our client work, this often comes up because you’re right, we are that one that’s like the ball catcher, like the visionary is the one that makes it up. We’re the one that makes it real. We’re the one that makes it happen. And say, okay, what’s the plan? What’s the schedule? What are the resources that we need in terms of systems or processes or people? The people that we have, the people that we don’t have, like all of those wheels, start to kick in.
14:05
Derek Fredrickson
And sometimes I think the sign of a really good integrator and especially the ones that are familiar with EOs or the ones that have been doing COO work for quite some time like with our clients. When the visionary comes in and says, I got these great ideas, one year, three years, whatever, I don’t even know what the timing. I just think it’s a great idea. I want to put it to action. Sometimes the integrator in the past would say, okay, which of these other things that are already on the list are we going to remove? To slide this one in, as if there’s a finite area of work.
14:37
Derek Fredrickson
And oftentimes that’s in my experience, it’s the worst thing that you could do to a visionary because you’re basically reflecting back that idea isn’t good because I can’t allocate the time or the resources to move it forward. Sometimes they just want to have it heard. They just want it to land someplace. And then there’s the discussion. Okay, strategically speaking, right. With the rest of our projects and priorities and what you’ve got going on, where would it make sense? Is this a Q1 thing? Is this a Q2 thing? Maybe some things we could start now to mobilize it and get some action, but we’re not expecting to get it done the next 30 days because that might be trying to move mountains. And so being able to balance that, it’s not easy. It takes with you experience and time, but being able to juggle that.
15:18
Derek Fredrickson
How has that been for you both as an integrator, but now with your second in command, how does that relationship work? And is it similar to that or any other hack that you have in terms of how you go about doing that?
15:28
Kristie Clayton
No, I love that you brought that up because that is the one thing that is the first question I really tried to come across with her is, you know, when I’m sharing an idea, please ask me time frame, because I may be speaking three years, right? You’re thinking like tomorrow and I’m three years out. So ask that question, like, get curious with me so that I can share all the details. Because I will tell you, as a visionary, one of the things that will really start to like, close me off and start to get me to communicate less and less is when you tell me no.
16:05
Derek Fredrickson
Exactly. So true.
16:07
Kristie Clayton
Right. And for integrators and COOs, I think the one thing that really needs to be understood is how you’re saying no without using the word No.
16:23
Derek Fredrickson
Tell me more about that. That’s very powerful.
16:25
Kristie Clayton
Yeah. So it’s kind of what you just said, right? Where, you know, I start asking the questions of how are we going to do this? You know, what are we going to take off so that this can be done? You know what? All of a sudden, those 21 questions that you’re now coming at me and just, I’m like, well, wait, like, they’re not interested in this, they don’t want to do this, and I need to stop talking and I just need to shut this down.
16:49
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
16:50
Kristie Clayton
So now I start to. I start to tell you less. And now what starts to happen long term is I start to tell you less and less of my ideas. And the really, like, the bad thing about that is there may be one of those that I’m not telling you that is the brilliant.
17:05
Derek Fredrickson
Exactly.
17:06
Kristie Clayton
what can happen.
17:07
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
17:07
Kristie Clayton
So always coach my clients, because I coach a lot of integrators and COOs is how do you get what you need from the visionary? How do you stay in a playground with them to get all of the vision and then ask those questions about when do you see this happening? How does this fit into the bigger picture without saying no at the very beginning?
17:33
Derek Fredrickson
So true. So true. It’s. It’s something I’ve had to learn myself over 15 years of doing COO work, which is oftentimes I go into, how? how are we going to make that happen? There’s so many unknowns, there’s so many uncertainties, there’s so many variables I need to figure out and control. So my knee jerk reaction is I don’t know if we can do that. And what I’ve realized is that when you stifle a visionary’s ideation, you are stifling the thing that actually the visionary adds the most value to their organization. So I’ve conditioned myself and trained myself and our team as well. I’ll do it. So Kristie has a great idea. Kris. I love that idea. I love the idea. I think it’s great.
18:14
Derek Fredrickson
And I want to think through a few things of what might be involved to make that happen, because I think it’s incredible. It’s very emotive, it’s very expressive. It’s not. Ugh, Yeah, I don’t know about that. That’s not. I don’t see how that’s going to work. Like, it’s all mindset. It’s. It’s a different shift in perspective. And then in the analogy of throwing spaghetti at the wall, there may be bowls of spaghetti that have been thrown at the wall that are still sticking for months and months. And we can always pull the spaghetti back off again. But at the same time, sometimes it just wants to be landed, captured and they want to be heard so that it doesn’t mean it has to get done. They know that it’s not going to get done tomorrow.
18:52
Derek Fredrickson
There’s a lot that’s involved that they may not know about from their seat, but from our seat as a COO, we have all of that oversight and that ability to make those types of decisions, but it’s the ability to let it come, capture it without the feeling of needing to go and make it happen right away. Right. Because we just want to like, execute and go get it done. So I love that. I love that.
19:14
Kristie Clayton
Exactly. And I think there is a big point there too, that when this relationship does start to happen, a lot of times, like I can tell you, when I was sitting in this, the integrator seat, I did that too. And I didn’t even know, right. The words that were coming out of my mouth, even though I was trying to be curious and I was trying to understand the 21, you know, fire drill questions, what I was saying without saying it was no. But then also watch your body language a lot too, right? Because if you immediately, you know, cross your arms, you know, start shaking your head or looking worried like your facial expressions of, oh, crap, oh, not another thing.
19:59
Derek Fredrickson
No, we don’t want that.
20:01
Kristie Clayton
What you’re telling me as visionary is no, right? It’s an art to be able to really get the vision out. And I like to describe it, Derek, what I coach my clients is think of it as a sandbox, right? And this is just a vision sandbox. And you think about building a sand castle. And when you bring the visionary into that sandbox and you permission yourself, this is not concrete. This is sand we’re playing with. You can now take your integrator, how to tack off and say, I’m just going to play here. And so I will tell you, I’ve been in conversation with my own integrator where I see her like I can, I can feel it because I can. I can hear her words start to shift. Her questions start to shift to how tos.
20:59
Kristie Clayton
And I can also watch her facial expressions and her body language that she’s now gone into execution mode. And I can say, hold on, hold on. No, no, no. We’re playing here, right? Come back to the visionary sandbox with me and play with me. What can this look like, you know, what would we need to change, like all of surface? And then it also permissions her to now enter into that zone of. But wait a minute. We’re playing here. Let me ask more, you know, more questions along the lines of what it looks like and things like that.
21:34
Derek Fredrickson
I love that.
21:35
Kristie Clayton
When it’s ready to go from sandbox to actually creating an execution, that’s when it needs to become concrete.
21:42
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
21:43
Kristie Clayton
Concrete is hard and it is permanent. The sandbox, the sand is just its play. We can take that section of the sand castle down and we can carve out more windows. We can create a boat. We can do all the things, but we’re still playing. We can even take a bucket of water and just throw it. Exactly.
22:05
Derek Fredrickson
I use the sandbox analogy all the time. It is so true. Let the visionary be in the sandbox. That’s where they bring 80% of the value is not in the doing, it’s in the thinking. And when they’re in the sandbox visioning the bigger future, ideating what the next phase of growth could look like, you don’t want to put parameters around what that needs to be in terms of the structure of the plan or the schedule of the process or the mechanics to get it done. Let that kind of play around in a way. And then when it comes out and said, here’s what I’m thinking, then we could start to really get clear on using the sandbox analogy. Like how many floors and how many windows and what does it look like?
22:44
Derek Fredrickson
Tell me more, tell me more about, you know, we’re fact finders as COO, so the more information we can get about that idea, the more we can get excited about, okay, great. Now I know how to go and make that happen. So when you start to take me.
22:56
Kristie Clayton
To the how to, you’re also now taking me to the short term.
23:00
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah, right.
23:01
Kristie Clayton
Today. And that as visionary, I prefer to live way out in the future. Right.
23:06
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
23:07
Kristie Clayton
So now you become frustrated for me too, where I’m like, oh, my goodness, the questions have changed to something that’s getting more in depth and more detailed and in the weight. And that’s your expertise. That’s not where I want to live. Let’s go let you do that either with the leadership team or on your own clarity breaks or whatever.
23:32
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
23:32
Kristie Clayton
But stay in the sand and have fun with me.
23:35
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah, wonderful. I want to ask a question. So you have this idea of whole human leadership. We talked about that. When we first met, which is this idea of working with, you know, because your group are women, second in command, fractional executives, and you support them, you coach them, you provide community, which is amazing. So tell me, what does whole human leadership mean? And as I understand it’s the, it’s the combination between kind of like the strategy and also like the emotional intelligence component. And so how do you describe the two of those? And what does that mean for you?
24:08
Kristie Clayton
Yeah, so I, I believe in whole human. I do not believe that we have work life balance and that you suddenly walk into an office building and now you’re only a professional, you know, or out of that and you go home and suddenly you’re only personal. I mean, we’re one person and our brains and our bodies, like, we should not divide like that. So for me, whole human really means you’re showing up as your whole self so that the talents and strengths that you have even in your home environment, the emotional intelligence and you know, some of the things that we learn, you know, as parents or as children and, you know, how we’re helping our adult parents, like all of the things that we learn throughout life can be applied to both sides of the business and in life.
24:58
Kristie Clayton
And so for me, whole human leadership is showing up as, yes, strategy and execution, but then also the emotional intelligence and leading with your whole self instead of trying to leave one side, you know, at home or at work. And I also want to say, like, I believe that all humans possess feminine and masculine energy.
25:24
Derek Fredrickson
Yes.
25:24
Kristie Clayton
Right. Just because I’m a female doesn’t mean I don’t have any masculine energy. And vice versa for you. And so when we’re able to show up with both sides of ourselves and we need that, we need to be able to show up as our whole selves. And that’s where we can really, truly lean into leadership and be able to have emotional intelligence. We can have the strategy, we can have accountability that really allows us to operate as our best selves and also really truly lead to the company being able to expedite and run in a well, professionally managed organization.
26:03
Derek Fredrickson
It’s such an important element that I think, and the way that you’ve described it and when we talked about that before, this is what really resonated because I believe in the same. I mean, you know, call it yin and yang, masculine, feminine, like right brain, left brain, the strategic and the more emote emotional intelligence side, there’s got to be a bridge, especially for the work that we do, because if you’re all one side, let’s say if you’re all masculine, they’re all strategy, all deadlines, all process, all, just like, get it done, get it, then, get it done. It might work for some companies and for some, I will say, cultures of organizations, and then that’s fine.
26:42
Derek Fredrickson
But then also when you are able to blend it with the emotional intelligence components, and I say, like masculine, feminine, yin and yang, it allows the executive, the CEO, to be able to, I think, operate at a different level and tap into the thing that maybe they didn’t know that they could tap into. Call it intuition, call it guidance, call it reflection in a way of. It’s not all, get it done, get it done. There might be a moment or a period of just, like I said, reflection or contemplation of what that really means. And like, tell me more, what does that really feel? We do this with our clients where I’ll often ask the question, or we will often ask the question client Susie, we don’t say, so what do you think about that? We’ll say, what do you feel about that?
27:30
Derek Fredrickson
Because thinking is more logic. It’s more just intelligence, and that’s important. But when you really want to get to, what does this really mean for you and what’s your real gut tell you? What does this feel for you? I don’t want to hear what you’re thinking. I want to hear what you’re feeling. And that’s the blend of the strategy and the emotional intelligence side. And I shared this with you, which I think is just so interesting. We got introduced through Paisley, who’s one of our fractional CEOs, and I know a big fan and a big member of your community. And, you know, we now have 15. We have 15 fractional COOs and fractional OBMs with 27 clients at this time. All of our team are women, because this is a value for me. I know that. Listen, I’m a man, right?
28:12
Derek Fredrickson
So I could be all strategy and all left brain or right brain, whatever one that is. But I also know with the clients that we work with, and 90% of our clients are women, there’s that emotional intelligence component about what you’re feeling, what’s coming up for you, what does that really intuitively speak to you? That’s super important in the work that we do with our clients at that level, because we are that trusted second in command like you have. So I think it’s great that you’re highlighting that more and more.
28:38
Kristie Clayton
Well, I think it’s just important to remember too, though, that I’ve had this happen before when I was working with an organization that we had an incredible, like a star player. They were just, they met deadlines, they exceeded expectations. Like, they were just one of those dream team members that you’re like, oh, this is amazing. And all of a sudden, and it was, it was pretty sudden that we recognized it. But looking back, it was probably one of those things we should have picked up on a little bit sooner. Their work declined, they weren’t meeting deadlines. And, you know, things just started to happen where you were like, what’s going on here? And if all you are is data and deadline driven, accountability driven, we could have easily went to that person and said, hey, listen, you’re not meeting anymore.
29:33
Kristie Clayton
You’re not meeting expectations anymore. This is your warning. And if you don’t, you know, increase your productivity, you’re gone. That is one way to handle it. And I know plenty of organizations that handle it that way. We went from a softer side of what is happening with this person. Like, why suddenly start happening? So we started having conversations of just like, hey, like, we just want to share with you what we’ve noticed and want to get feedback from you. And what we found out from them is in a matter of like three or four months, they had a death in the family. They had something happen at home. Like, it was. There was like a series of three things that happened to them that was pretty, like, traumatic for them. And listen, whether it’s traumatic for me or not, that doesn’t matter.
30:19
Kristie Clayton
It was traumatic for them. And that was what was leading to the decline in productivity and in meeting deadlines is because they were now consumed by that. And so we were able to step in and help in that way and say, hey, I’m so glad you’ve now shared that with me. Because we can look at ways, how can we help you? What can we do to support you through this? And we were really, truly able to contribute. And now not only do I have a person who’s working turn to star employee again. Like, they were contributing and they were exceeding again. They were meeting deadlines again. But now I also have a person who is loyal to us because we were really focused on them and them as a whole. Not them as an employee, but them as a human being.
31:07
Kristie Clayton
Because at the end of the day, Derek, that’s what we all are. We are all flawed human beings who are trying to do our Absolute best and most. And if we can’t see the other side of things, then we are not helping those people achieve that. I’ve gone through it as well myself. And because we created a culture of, hey, when someone’s not like, when you just see a difference in someone, just ask them a question. I asked the same question too. You know, I can go through the logic side of, you know, how does this make you feel? But asking the question like, wait a minute, can I just slow down just a second and ask you, how are you feeling right now about what we’re doing?
31:46
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah.
31:49
Kristie Clayton
It’S a different conversation.
31:51
Derek Fredrickson
It is, it is. I often do that when. And thank you for sharing that. This is really important that it gets out there for people to understand in terms of working with teams and working with their. Their employees. And I’ve seen this time and time again where having the awareness or the emotional intelligence, as you say, to ask the question, that’s under the question. Right. So the question on the surface might be, why didn’t this get done? What’s going on with this project? Why are this deadline get passed? What’s causing these issues to surface? But it’s also in a way of positioning and kind of body language and how you’re kind of meeting them. You don’t know without asking. They may be at like a 1 out of 10 and you’re coming at them and being like, what’s going on?
32:29
Derek Fredrickson
Where they need to feel safe to come to you with what’s going on. And so oftentimes what we do again with our clients or with team is we don’t talk about the work stuff. I’ll just say, how are things going generally? Just what’s on your heart, what’s top of mind. And if you give them the space where they can feel trusted to share without judgment and feel that there’s a level of vulnerability that’s allowed and supported, it can sometimes uncover what’s really going on. And in your example, and there’s so many that we know and have seen in the past where there’s something that we would have no idea that was going on in their world unless we got to the question that allowed them to feel safe and share. And I know that this is a big whole human leadership. Yes.
33:15
Derek Fredrickson
But also in this kind of supportive capacity, you’ve built this amazing peer community with FEM, Female Executive Mastermind and Herverse.
And so I want you to share a little bit about that organization and what you do there. But I want to ask you first… and I like asking this type of question to our guests because, I want to ask the question this way. Why this idea of women, peer support and community? Why you? Meaning why is that your thing and why now? Why is that something that’s top of mind for you now?
33:55
Kristie Clayton
Yeah, that’s a cool. I love how you ask those questions. And I think that there’s several things for me. First, why now? I, when I was at a wealth management firm where I was sitting as the integrator, my visionary leader would go off to his peer community and he would come back and I was literally watching two things happening. One is his exponential growth. Every time he came back from being with his peers, I could see him growing and developing in that way as his own visionary leader. And I was like, I want that too. I want to continue growing and developing as a second in command leader, which we now refer to as right hand. Right. I want to continue growing in that way. And I started to recognize that I needed an avenue and a way to do that.
34:48
Kristie Clayton
And so I reached out to everyone… that I knew and I very specifically, Derek was looking to connect with other integrators that were running their companies on EOS. And this was 14 years ago now, 12 years ago now, however long it was.
35:03
Derek Fredrickson
Long time ago.
35:04
Kristie Clayton
Yeah, no, it’s been a while. More than a decade ago. I really, I wanted to be deeply connected to them because we had a shared language, we had already had a sense of community. And so I reached out to several people that I had met as implementers at the very first Integrator Mastery Forum then, that was hosted and then at the very first EOS conference. And I just reached out and I said, hey, listen, does anybody know of a peer community for integrators? And everybody said, no, but you need to create that. And I was like, whoa, nine months into my journey here, I’m looking.
35:40
Derek Fredrickson
To find something, not create something. That’s the sign. That’s the sign.
35:46
Kristie Clayton
But then I was so desperate for those connections and it was not created. So I said, okay, great, if we’re going to do this. I reached out to several women that I had met and I said, here’s what I’m thinking. We keep this super simple, my friends. Let’s have a WhatsApp chat where we can ask each other questions, we can support one another, we can celebrate what we celebrate. Because nobody celebrates what a COO celebrates.
36:10
Derek Fredrickson
Exactly. Oh, that’s true. It’s true.
36:12
Kristie Clayton
They’re always like, why are we celebrating? That’s so weird. So we have that community that could really help us. And what I witnessed is on many occasions, that the first time it happened was when I realized that this is what I was really, truly meant to do, is we had a woman who came to the group and said, I’m frustrated to the point that I’m really, truly thinking about exiting this company. I’ve had it. This is an issue that has come up multiple times over the last decade. And every time we think we have it solved, it resurfaces. And the group was able to sit with her and say, first of all, you’re not alone, friend. Right? So now she got off of Lonely Integrator island and was with her. With those that understood her again.
37:04
Kristie Clayton
The second thing is people started chipping in and saying, hey, this. I’ve done this, and it worked for me. Oh, wait, hey, I tried this. It did not work. And let me tell you all the reasons why it didn’t. And she walked away With several ideas. A couple of months later, she came back to the group and she said, hey, I just want to share an update with you. I did a little bit of this and a little bit of this, and this is the plan that I put together. And this issue has literally shown up week after week after week for a decade. We have not heard about it in six months. All the root issue. And so this group of peers was able to help her. And here’s what I say about Herverse. H.E.R. is an acronym.
37:52
Kristie Clayton
It’s Helping Executives Rise. And that’s what we’re looking for. We’re not one of those women’s groups that is bashing men. We’re not robbering or any of that kind of stuff. There’s a time and a place for things, but that’s not the time or place for us. What we are truly uhm meant to do in this world, and what I’m meant to do is to help women achieve their goals with confidence. And that’s what Hervverse is doing. We are pulling women together who want to grow, who want to develop, uhm and who want to do it together. These women are your biggest supporters, will laugh and cry with you when you need that. They are the women. They are the women that are cheering you on. They’re standing behind you with their hands on your shoulders, and they’re. They’re. They’re cheering for you.
38:48
Kristie Clayton
And that’s what this group of women are.
38:51
Derek Fredrickson
That’s amazing. And, well, that’s the why. I mean that right there, right when with anybody. But for you, this is the why. Because you can see clearly. There’s. Whenever there’s an emotional component, there’s obviously a sign that it’s on. It’s an alignment. And thank you for sharing so transparently and so vulnerably what it means not only for the women in the community, but also for you. And the why that exists. Yes. In practice, it’s a community. It’s asking for help. It’s relying on your peers. It’s “don’t be too cool for school” and think that you’re all alone and you’re the only one that’s ever had this question or this issue or this problem. It’s asking for help, but asking, maybe not up and asking, you know, your CEO, the one that you might be the COO for, because they may have a different perspective.
39:43
Derek Fredrickson
It’s asking the people that are on the same journey, the ones that are doing the work, just like with you, that have, this is what worked, this is what didn’t work. And really just the courage to say, I have a question. I need some help. Who can offer and in your community, I’m sure everybody’s, “I..happy to. I’ve got so many examples or so many resources or however I can help.”
I love, I love that you’re doing it with the spin that you’re creating for female executives and helping executives rise and just leveraging that kind of peer component in the sense of, I mean, you’ve got events coming up. You do, you do coaching. Tell us a little bit about that.
40:20
Derek Fredrickson
For people that are watching and want to find out more about Kristie and Herverse and FEM and everything that you’re doing, tell us a little bit about where they can find out more. And also you’ve got your event coming up in a few months. 93 days, I think you mentioned last time.
40:33
Kristie Clayton
Oh, 93 days from today. Yes.
40:35
Derek Fredrickson
It may not be 93 days by the time people watch this, but.
40:39
Kristie Clayton
Yes, yes, very true.
40:40
Derek Fredrickson
We’ll put the dates in the show notes.
40:42
Kristie Clayton
93 days from the day we’re recording this, but yes. So one thing that, to just add to what you said is, you know, what is the expectation when you join this organization? And what I say is it is an expectation of interactions and connections, not transactions. Which is why we are a pure community versus a peer network. If you’re showing up to be able to exchange business cards so that you can gain business from one another. That is not this community. This community really truly is focused on how do I grow and develop as a second in command, right hand leader. How can I, personally get better? How can I professionally get better? What can I take back to my team? What can I take back to my organization to strengthen it and to make it better?
41:30
Kristie Clayton
And so we do that in three ways. We have memberships where you can come and get involved in a virtual community, workshops. We have a couple of different forum experiences, whether it’s roundtable, small groups of women to get together for a short period of time every month. We have a mastermind where people spend a lot of time together really growing and developing. It’s incredible. And then we have our summit that we do every year. We’re going to be 8th summit. I’m super excited about it. It is such a sign of infinity. And so this one is going to be really special. We’re going to be in Houston on November 5th through the 7th and we have some incredible speakers that are coming in. And Derek, what I love about this is we’re really truly like listening to the needs of our people.
42:22
Kristie Clayton
So a lot of times when you go to a conference you’ll hear speakers and they will be sharing theoretically what they are doing or you know, this is possible. The difference here is these are women who most of the speakers are integrators or COOs as well. And they’re not telling you theoretically what you could do. They’re giving you application. This is how I’ve done it. These are the things to watch out for because they didn’t work for me. And they are literally handing you over their playbook, their tools, their resources because they’ve been there and they’ve done that and somebody did that for them. And so they are vested in. I want to give back to my community as well. That’s really fun and exciting. But also summit is a whole human experience, right? So we’re going to have workshops, we’re going to have breakout speakers.
43:14
Kristie Clayton
Of course we have our opening and closing keynotes. But then we also do a personal vision planning session where we going to get deep into what do you want to do with your future. And so, it’s just, it’s a fun, exciting and like just a deeply connected group of women. When we get together, I always love it when we show up because you’ll see women that have gone some of them all eight years at this point and they will run from one side of the hotel lobby to the other and embrace each other and, you know, ask, how are things going? Get caught up. And then I’ve had women, it’s their very first time, and they’re like, the way that this community opened their arms and just welcomed me in as if I’d been here 10 times already.
44:08
Derek Fredrickson
Yeah That’s beautiful. That’s the sign of a good community when you have people that have been going and the why is still there. So they keep going year after year. And there are those that are new, maybe skeptical at first, but when they show up, they feel like I’ve been missing this community this whole time. I didn’t know. And they feel just as at home as the ones that have been going because it just feels like it is home. And I love what you shared with your summit and everything else that you do with Herverse. It’s about the individual, but it’s also about the collective, because it is about the community. But it’s also, how do you. Like you said, who’s the leader that you want to be or what are the goals that you want to have in your professional journey?
44:50
Derek Fredrickson
So I love everything about what we’ve talked about. I love your mission, I love your why. I love why you jump out of bed in the morning to do this. It’s so clear as day that this is your visionary sandbox, if you will, to bring it back full circle. And we’ll include the links in the show notes for obviously Herverse and the summit. And if you’re looking to connect with Kristie on LinkedIn, I’m sure people can find you there on LinkedIn as well. Any final closing thoughts or words of wisdom before we wrap up here, Kristie?
45:22
Kristie Clayton
Yeah. So one of my languages, like my language of appreciation, is gifts. And I would love to offer your community, your network, a gift from me that if you do register for summit or if you sign up for an elite membership, use the code Thrive2025 and that will get you a 10% savings off of your registration.
45:46
Derek Fredrickson
Wonderful.
45:48
Kristie Clayton
My gift to you, Derek, that you can offer to your group, and here’s what I would say is if you are a COO or an integrator, whether you’re day one and just learning or your day 15, it is a journey, my friends, and being surrounded by those Who are on the path that you are, and being surrounded by those who have been there, done that, there’s nothing more profound than that. Get connected. Whether it’s Herverse or another community, get connected with your people. We want to see you thrive. We want to see you do well. And we would be so incredibly excited to have you part of our community. But definitely be part of a community.
46:33
Derek Fredrickson
Sure. Well, that’s the lesson. My word of appreciation is active service. Or I’d like to thank you for agreeing to be a guest on the show today and sharing your message and sharing your wisdom. And it’s just been a true honor to get to know you even more, Kristie. I know that we’ll continue to do some great work together. Yeah. And thank you for being on the show and thank you for watching everybody. And until next time, we’ll see you on the future episodes of the SIWA Solution podcast. Thanks.
47:01
Kristie Clayton
Thanks, Derek, for having me.
47:02
Derek Fredrickson
You’re welcome. Thank you.